We have a love / hate relationship with the naughties here at Fat Lace. It appears HHC do too. Their editorial has recently been leaning more to the golden era than a feigned appreciation of what’s hot right now. We’ve all had brief flings with Crunk, Hyphy, B More Club and the like but when it comes down to it you always revert back to what excited you about hip-hop when you first fell for it’s charms and for vets likes us it comes down to the ’80s and ’90s more often than not. Go visit our peers at RTNY and they paint a different picture and have a younger demographic who’ve grown up with G-Unit on their iPods and wouldn’t piss on a Fat Lace blog post if it were on fire. The questions we ask ourselves always come down to this. 1) Was hip-hop really better pre-millennium or was it just slightly less affected than it is now? 2) Are we of a peer group that truly believe the music has seen better times and do we have the right to get on our high horse about it? 3) Who says dumbing out in style to the latest Thizz CD ain’t as real as an obscure Gangstarr B side and will people get dewy eyed about Lil Flip in ten years time? 4) Do we just accept that the music has become more of a commercial entity than an artform and let the shorties carry the torch, if they drop it and burn holes in the carpet then at least we can’t be blamed for not doing our bit.
36 responses so far ↓
1 brian beck from wisconsin // Apr 7, 2008 at 2:29 pm
I think the 90s is my personal fav period for rap not just because of the nostalgia factor that you mentioned but because it was the time when all 3 coasts and the mid-west were killing it, the foundations were still being built and it was the point where rap albums were at their most cohesive post-golden era token hip house/rock guitar joints and pre-sample clearance ravaging them completely and rappers making albums trying to cater to every type of rap demographic after Life After Death.
That sounds really gay because i still love new rap and there’s tons of albums i love from the last 8 years which will be future classics but i guess it was slightly more fresh back then for me due to the foundations still being laid back then. Now everything is established and merely building on the foundations laid during the 80s and 80s so there aren’t too many suprises and i don’t really tend to get the WTF was that? factor any more but that inevitably happens with every genre of music after 15 – 20 years.
The worst thing/best thing about rap right now is the internet. It’s the worst thing because it’s completely demystified everything about rap, made music a lot more disposable and i wish i never knew about soundscans and the like. It’s the best thing because i love the gossip and immediacy it allows and because without it most of us probably wouldn’t be up on so many obscure regional scenes and styles.
2 brian beck from wisconsin // Apr 7, 2008 at 2:41 pm
Damn, my post reads really bitter old man-ish.
To clarify : when i say i don’t get the WTF was that? factor any more i don’t mean i don’t hear music which doesn’t blow me allow anymore. I mean, i don’t hear anything which i’d consider that next-level shit because after around 2000 or so everything had been done and every new micro sound and trend since then is merely a sidestep variation on a sound from the 80s or 90s.
3 lace da booze // Apr 7, 2008 at 3:20 pm
i agree with BB. I like less stuff these days but that just means I end up playing the stuff I do like for longer.
92-95 was the shit tho – cant fuck with it!
4 i the t // Apr 7, 2008 at 3:29 pm
since when was the 90’s the golden era ?
my fav period was mid to late 80’s cause that’s when i was at my most fanatical stage of awe with it. plus in mid 80’s, breakin was still goin strong which was just as important as the music back then.
90’s obviously had amazing music but i was older then so i weren’t as impressionable.
Noughties I couldn’t give a flyin fuck for i’m afraid. although I still keep my ear to the ground, the last great album i heard that i listened to over and over and knew the lyrics to was Skillionaire.
blah, etc, humbug, creak.
5 brian beck from wisconsin // Apr 7, 2008 at 3:33 pm
lace da booze // Apr 7, 2008 at 3:20 pm
i agree with BB.
Ominous.
6 End Level Boss // Apr 7, 2008 at 3:34 pm
‘91 to ‘96 is my favorite time, but there is still plenty of dope Hip Hop coming out IMO. But I’m an old bastard (34) so who cares what I think?
7 Doc Sox // Apr 7, 2008 at 3:57 pm
‘let the shorties carry the torch, if they drop it and burn holes in the carpet then at least we can’t be blamed for not doing our bit.’
preach on!
8 Doc Sox // Apr 7, 2008 at 3:58 pm
personally i’m all about march 12th, 1991 to august 23rd, 1994..
9 Fred Fence // Apr 7, 2008 at 5:13 pm
Hip Hop was way better back then. It’s pretty shit now, there’s still the odd spark of genius and some future classics come out, but back then you had hit after hit after hit of solid heavyweight classic shit, now it’s lost it’s steam, and thats not an age thing, it’s just a fact.
10 Fred Fence // Apr 7, 2008 at 5:15 pm
ps.my fave year for hip hop apart from 1985 was 1990, chubb rock ‘treat em right’ EP and ‘the one’ LP, special ed ‘legal’, JVC Force ‘Force Field’…do you get LP’slike that now…nope.
11 brian beck from wisconsin // Apr 7, 2008 at 5:35 pm
Did this guy really just say that there’s no modern rap albums as good as fucking Force Field by JVC Force?
If so, lol.
12 salvador darlo // Apr 7, 2008 at 5:56 pm
He did. I do really like that LP – but that is mental.
13 Big Daddy Doug // Apr 8, 2008 at 8:01 am
Basically it comes down to what shit you heard when you were 12-15, ’cause no shit ends up doing your head in more than that. Although I love most of the classic early to mid-90s stuff (the majority mention of which probably makes most of the fools reading this stuff in their mid to late 20s), nothing does it for me like the 80s. As good as a classic Pete Rock , Premiere or Tribe joint from 92 sounds, it’ll always pale a bit in comparison to an old school Marley Marl track, an early Def Jam, or some classic Run DMC. And while I still keep an ear open and hear some things I like, the answer is NO. Hip hope used to be better, period. Everybody knows that who’s old enough to know better. Not saying that none of the new stuff’s valid, it just comes out of a climate and an industry that’s so different it’s impossible to compare.
14 DoughBoy // Apr 8, 2008 at 10:26 am
in the 90s somethin like group home was a big deal but now somethin as good as that wouldnt even get a mention, thats a difference, then and now.
15 met to the cee // Apr 8, 2008 at 10:48 am
I have been listening to DJ 279 for a number of weeks and he plays 90’s and I love every minute of it.
Dope hip hop is
a dope mc
a dope beat
a dope sample
end of.
Salvador, I’ll be in touch very soon.
16 i the t // Apr 8, 2008 at 11:23 am
mate,
samples didn’t really come in til as late as 86 (unless you include scratched in sounds).
there’s a whole era of raw as fuck hip-hop before anyone plugged in an SP-1200.
17 cruzankillamonk // Apr 8, 2008 at 12:00 pm
The 90’s were the shit ..although i fell inlove with hip hop since early 80’s at 34 now and listening to the new rap and hip hop swag its become far more commercially succesfull which is great. Rap gave a bunch of folks disposable income and gave hope to many who have nothing else to feel good about. Above all it gave people jobs …yes you white guy with kangol yes you young knuckle head street team yes you blogger…lets give thanks to hip hop and the monster decade of the 90’s
18 met to the cee // Apr 8, 2008 at 12:10 pm
i the t,
ok, dope is
a dope mc
a dope beat
Am I cool enough now?
19 D to the S // Apr 8, 2008 at 12:31 pm
The early 2000’s were decent. But yeah, the 90s were the bomb.
20 Big Daddy Doug // Apr 8, 2008 at 12:59 pm
Doughboy, then and now, we’d still make fun of Group Home lyrics….”Hitler was a dickhead!”
21 DoughBoy // Apr 8, 2008 at 1:29 pm
haha yeah, meant a group like that wouldnt get any exposure these days but back then they were a decent priority
22 JimmyC // Apr 8, 2008 at 2:25 pm
I’ve been listening to the rub 90s mixes a lot over the past few days and it’s ridiculous how many amazing tracks came out each year. I’d struggle to think of 10 tracks released last year that i’d ever give a shit about hearing again, never mind 60+…
23 i the t // Apr 8, 2008 at 3:30 pm
met to the cee,
you’re coolness can only be measured by your actions in real life, not cyberspace.
i weren’t tryin to persecute you blad, or make you feel any more insignificant than you already are in relation to the universe.
i’ll be more considerate next time i take issue with peoples blogs, i now understand the ramifications it can have on a persons emotional well-being..
feelings assuaged yet ?
24 Fred Fence // Apr 8, 2008 at 4:17 pm
I was just saying that ‘forcefield’ was a bad LP, I had it glued to the deck when it came out…what LP’s do I have glued to the deck now, I end up skipping most of them coz I only like a handfulof tracks, to me yeah, ‘force field ‘and ‘the one’ are more loved by me than any LP I’ve bought in the last 10 years, I’m just speaking for me, it’s my personal choice, I like many new LP’s but 1985 and 1990 was the years my favourite ever shit came out, not better or worse technically than new stuff, just my own favourite Hip Hop records.
25 Big Daddy Doug // Apr 8, 2008 at 4:39 pm
Hey Jimmy C,
Ya wanna know why so many good tracks came out in the early to mid-90s? Because Gilbert O’Sullivan hadn’t heard I Need a Haircut yet. Seriously, as soon as sampling became something you had to pay big dollars for what was a Large Professor to do?
26 Skilletor // Apr 8, 2008 at 4:54 pm
top 5 90s:
main source
brand nubian
ice rube
pete rock and cl smooth
snoop doggy dog
27 JimmyC // Apr 8, 2008 at 5:13 pm
The Biz vs Sullivan case was in 91, and there was still plenty of good hip-hop released after that so I don’t think he can take all the blame.
28 salvador darlo // Apr 8, 2008 at 5:32 pm
Yo Fred Fence – I hear you man. However, do you even like ‘Cat’?
29 Big Daddy Doug // Apr 8, 2008 at 6:13 pm
Yeah I was just using Biz as one of the best-known examples, not that that case is entirely to blame. Hey, the Turtles sued De La and that was still pre-1990. I just meant that the freedom producers had enjoyed in sampling and beatmaking (the renaissance of which really took hold in 88 and lasted about 6 years) started to wane with the rising costs, making the music steadily change (and arguably get less creative, interesting, etc)…
30 Wu-zy // Apr 8, 2008 at 8:20 pm
growing commercial influence always = lesser artistic output – guess the 90s were a hip-hop last stand (albeit a very slowly eroding one)!
things just seemd more innocent tehn
31 Fred Fence // Apr 9, 2008 at 4:20 pm
‘cat’is a fuckin tuuuuuune…I love that shit too mate! The only one I was lunke warm on was ‘bring them home safely’. My favourite is that ‘another vital statistic’ or whatever it called, I know it by sound, not name of track coz my memory’s shit, but you know the one, it’s an amazing track, I think fatlace should have ‘the one’ appreciation day.
32 met to the cee // Apr 9, 2008 at 5:17 pm
what about ‘the big man’ – great remixes on the 12″
33 salvador darlo // Apr 9, 2008 at 5:39 pm
Yeah ‘The One’ is no doubt an album that should get way more props than it does!
Met To The Cee is right too – that 12″ was like Biggie before Biggie – with the smoothed out samples and fat man voice.
Met – holler
34 JoseG // Apr 10, 2008 at 10:58 am
the 90s eh? it’ll never catch on!
35 Dutch // Apr 11, 2008 at 6:38 pm
remember that 90s comp scratch guys did? Dope!!
36 brian beck from wisconsin // Apr 15, 2008 at 12:44 pm
Good issue.
Lovin’ the rap/r&b collabo section of the We <3 The 90s List, in particular, and Greenpeace’s anecdotes about being acosted by angry UK rappers over bad HHC reviews by other HHC scribes.
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